7-hom levels on lab results - does it matter?

[add to descartes]

I've been looking at some labs for a certain vendor, and I've noticed that the levels for 7-hydroxymitragynine are listed on some strains, and absent on others. they're usually around 0.01- 0.02%, and it seems that larger amounts are found in the red strains. but is it actually important?

as with all things kratom, there's not much consensus on how it works. it's a lot of speculation and varying opinions on whether it matters. I've seen some people say that the amount is negligible, as it isn't enough to have effects on its own. they say it would take many times the amount present to have noticeable effects; that it's the amount metabolized from the mitragynine in the body that makes the difference. then I've seen others who say that they specifically look for the levels of 7-hom; the higher the better.

I don't know if there is conclusive proof or not. I do know that the amount of mitragynine by itself is not always an indicator of quality; strains with even a particularly high amount of mitra (>1.5%) can be duds. and for me, the "red" reds never work, even though their level of 7-hom is relatively high.

[Redlion40]

Two topics to consider. Mitragynine becomes 7-OH in the body in the liver. Two, a lower mitragynine level lets 7-OH work better because mitragynine blocks the effects of all opioid agonists (including 7-OH) at a certain level. Whatever is printed on the label won't be close to what it will be inside of your body in the end.

[BallzDeep9]

... I've noticed that the levels for 7-hydroxymitragynine are listed on some strains, and absent on others. they're usually around 0.01- 0.02% ...

Yep. Another bunch of... myths and mis-information. As usual lol - Partly due to BS established long ago, before we had better Science and lab tests in recent years.

So, Science has discovered in recent years #1- Mitragynine is metabolized in the Liver where it converts to 7-Ohm.. And #2 - There isn't enough 7-Ohm in powder kratom, to have any effect. Not enough for threshold effects, only a trace amount in powder. Here's a good LINK from Reddit:

The 7-hydroxymitragynine number doesn't matter. We now know that the amount of 7-hydroxymitragynine in the leaf isn't enough to have any effect. Kruegel and Grundmann pointed out that an 8g dose of kratom has 5-10x less 7-OHM than needed for effects in humans. Meanwhile, mitragynine is metabolized into enough 7-OHM to account for all of its opioid-receptor-mediated effects.

The AKA has been going around, claiming that kratom is "adulterated" and, ALSO suggesting that kratom is being spiked with added 7-Ohm. . That's part of their KCPA "Regulation" being pushed on states. So.... states that have bought into the KCPA BS, the Regulation Laws, have some statement about 7-Ohm Limits, and a Law that ALL kratom sold, must have a Lab Test for Mitragynine - and also, a separate Lab Test for 7-Ohm.

For Example, that's part of Oklahoma Law now. The vendor, Okie Kratom, has a Label that states potency testing, because it's required under State Law.

Weird. I don't recall ONE example, 1 actual proven case, of a Kratom product sold, that was "spiked" with added 7-Ohm ??

[add to descartes]

The 7-hydroxymitragynine number doesn't matter. We now know that the amount of 7-hydroxymitragynine in the leaf isn't enough to have any effect. Kruegel and Grundmann pointed out that an 8g dose of kratom has 5-10x less 7-OHM than needed for effects in humans. Meanwhile, mitragynine is metabolized into enough 7-OHM to account for all of its opioid-receptor-mediated effects.

yep, that's the exact post I saw on reddit, which to me seemed the most legitimate. when I went to corroborate it, is when I saw all sorts of crazy ideas about how people thought it actually worked. if you read a thread with 20 comments, you get 20 different answers...

so it's interesting to me that vendors would list the 7-hom levels at all on their labs. maybe they do it because people ask for it, not knowing better. but by having it tested for, it continues the misinformation cycle. that is, unless the vendors don't know better....

maybe there ought to be a massive kratom re-education effort.

[mivanqua]

Mit is a pro-drug is what it amounts to. A thousand mysteries with this stuff.

https://youtu.be/1b2RUpzW6IM

Two topics to consider. Mitragynine becomes 7-OH in the body in the liver. Two, a lower mitragynine level lets 7-OH work better because mitragynine blocks the effects of all opioid agonists (including 7-OH) at a certain level. Whatever is printed on the label won't be close to what it will be inside of your body in the end.

This seems counterintuitive but its exactly what seems to be the case.

I think thats a big problem with humans. Everything has to "make sense" even though nothing ever really does.

Gotta put everything in a box but guess what? We're all out of boxes.

[add to descartes]

we really just need more extensive scientific study done, and ideally, more than one. as far as I know, the only study being done is the one at UCF. I don't even know if there are any being done anywhere else in the world, but please correct me if I'm wrong.

we're all basically just guessing and working with what little confirmed information we have; waiting for further findings from the McCready study; and learning from the vendors that have first hand knowledge (tfh chris's faq threads have been especially informative). we already know almost everything we first learned about kratom was wrong, like the common myths of strains and colors- which is still being propagated (usually for marketing purposes by larger vendors with an agenda).

it's definitely an uphill battle.