Don’t waste your money

[Ch98579]

Botanical Bunny Red MD lot 20 batch 2207 is at best half the quality we’d consider a normal product and that may be kind. I’ve always had a good experience with them in the past but don’t waste your money on this one. I have little idea of how the kratom business works and maybe somehow they have no choice but to move forward selling obviously sub par product to customers but it sure isn’t fun throwing away hundred dollar bills. Again I’ve received top quality kratom from them before and I know this issue isn’t specific to them but do avoid that particular batch. Happy hunting y’all!

[Kelleytoons]

Hmm, you do bring up an interesting point about getting some good stuff from a vendor but also getting junk. I think I'll make a separate topic about it.

[dylanmckay11]

Botanical Bunny Red MD lot 20 batch 2207 is at best half the quality we’d consider a normal product and that may be kind. I’ve always had a good experience with them in the past but don’t waste your money on this one. I have little idea of how the kratom business works and maybe somehow they have no choice but to move forward selling obviously sub par product to customers but it sure isn’t fun throwing away hundred dollar bills. Again I’ve received top quality kratom from them before and I know this issue isn’t specific to them but do avoid that particular batch. Happy hunting y’all!

I noticed this as well. First time its happened in few years of ordering. The red md was weak that batch and lot for me too.

[Kelleytoons]

I started to write a long post elsewhere but instead let me ask you something - did you contact the vendor? Many vendors will give you your money back (or at least give you another strain for free. Or, at the very worst, give you a very heavy discount on your next order).

I only ask because you said "throwing away hundred dollar bills" - no vendor worth their salt would allow their customers to have that kind of an experience. Particularly in this business, where word of mouth is almost the only thing most of them have going for them (I know of no one spending money on advertising - and where the heck would they advertise, anyway?).

If they don't value your custom then I wouldn't do business with them, even if some of their stuff is good. There are far better choices elsewhere.

[Ch98579]

I haven’t asked about it yet but may. Instead a just ordered from a vendor with lab tested mitra %. Anytime it’s happened in the past it’s been from a big commercial kratom vendor. I started ordering instead from small vendors and haven’t gotten a sub par order since until now. Thanks for the advice. I’ll try that, just didn’t want anyone else to buy that batch.

I started to write a long post elsewhere but instead let me ask you something - did you contact the vendor? Many vendors will give you your money back (or at least give you another strain for free. Or, at the very worst, give you a very heavy discount on your next order).

I only ask because you said "throwing away hundred dollar bills" - no vendor worth their salt would allow their customers to have that kind of an experience. Particularly in this business, where word of mouth is almost the only thing most of them have going for them (I know of no one spending money on advertising - and where the heck would they advertise, anyway?).

If they don't value your custom then I wouldn't do business with them, even if some of their stuff is good. There are far better choices elsewhere.

[IndelibleDotInk]

I only ask because you said "throwing away hundred dollar bills" - no vendor worth their salt would allow their customers to have that kind of an experience. Particularly in this business, where word of mouth is almost the only thing most of them have going for them (I know of no one spending money on advertising - and where the heck would they advertise, anyway?).

If they don't value your custom then I wouldn't do business with them, even if some of their stuff is good. There are far better choices elsewhere.

On some kratom related sites they have tons of ads. Even here, as you may have noticed and disregarded, there are ads threads at the top of some of the pages. Very passive, but I have tried some due to them, Garuda aka Hudson Valley (they're above standard, reliable enough to be in one person's favorite rotation). I have some Wild Green to try, and some type of gold which the person I was trading with won a kilo. He wasn't expecting much, but was quite happy, and so was I!

you are right about the business strategies, I would, and have, experienced great customer service from the majority of vendors. It's the customers who need to be upfront and bring attention if there is a prob.

[Kelleytoons]

Well, if you call making posts on FB or on forums advertising then, yes, there's a ton of it.

But as an old school guy (who used to work on ad campaigns) - if you don't pay for it, it ain't advertising. There is word of mouth, and there is advertising and that means spending $$$.

[IndelibleDotInk]

Some are paid and stickied to the top. Check and see, can even ask e_poison.

[Kelleytoons]

Right, I'm aware that some folks can pay for ads for forums (I'm a LONG time admin of many, many forums, some of which had millions of users each week).

[IndelibleDotInk]

Sounds like a sidestep of 'I was corrected.' But glad to have you here.

Have you joined MeWe? There are several kratom groups there, and a coffee group from which I'm procuring the finest coffee.

Aloha.

[IndelibleDotInk]

I gotta be aware of my sidestepping too. mahalo.

[Kelleytoons]

Not sidestepping just "paying for forum ads is the same as paying for advertising". NOT.

(As I said, I've run advertising campaigns. They cost $$$. Forum ads do not).

[add to descartes]

Not sidestepping just "paying for forum ads is the same as paying for advertising". NOT.

(As I said, I've run advertising campaigns. They cost $$$. Forum ads do not).

the forum ads here do cost money.

[Kelleytoons]

Pennies on the dollar, kid.

Look - I hate to be "the old man" here, but clearly I am. And clearly none of you have run a real business, one that required you spend AT LEAST 10% on advertising (most businesses budget FAR more). I would hazard a guess that there's no vendor out there that spends more than 1/10 of a percent on it. Maybe not even that.

That was my point but apparently I didn't make it clear enough so my bad. Sometimes I assume folks have the same life experience (and that's all on me - I really do know better).

[IndelibleDotInk]

there are a few other men with as much experience as you in some areas.

i'll stop wasting money at this point. Thanks guys.

[Sanbutsushin]

Well that sure was something.

Let us know what BB says if you decide to contact them about it. I was thinking the batch seeming subpar could just be the age-old "this works for someone else but not for me" or "put it away and try it again later" kratom crisis, but if multiple people are having issues with the batch, it's definitely worth bringing to BB's attention. I'm sure they'd want to know. Might have just slipped under their radar somehow. As far as I'm aware they have a good reputation, so I wouldn't expect them not to care, y'know?

[BallzDeep9]

I haven’t asked about it yet but may ... Instead a just ordered from a vendor with lab tested mitra %. Anytime it’s happened in the past it’s been from a big commercial kratom vendor. I started ordering instead from small vendors and haven’t gotten a sub par order since until now. Thanks for the advice. I’ll try that, just didn’t want anyone else to buy that batch.

That's fair. Sounds like you're talking from experience and the batch is truly sub-par. It happens. To all vendors - I wanted to chime in since I know B-B and used to sample/ Test for them a couple years ago... Haven't spoken in a while & idk details of their current supply - I only noticed their Lot # changed, which is the Batch Code they use to identify Supplier.

The traditional B-B Kratom is Direct Import from well known, top Indo sources: Kratom Crumbs, VLNT Herb, Golden Green, Nugroz, and others... has that changed ? obviously it's been a different Lot # this past year... Always been interesting, as far as Batch numbering or labels - B-B did also, go through some losses - Major losses on shipments, and on a Credit processing ripoff which affected a few vendors... It's been a tough business. B-B still does not post Lab Test results.

Hard to draw a conclusion off just 1 "Bad Review", as imo reviews are not worth much anyway ( just "reviews" in general.).. Negatives are unusual, and so maybe helpful for those who order Reds here - Bigger question is, what's happening with B-B ? and, have they gone to re-selling Bulk Wholesale - like so many others have ?? I guess it's watching and waiting for more reviews

Advertising ? not sure on that subject But - I'm on record wishing that Double MM should be - Vetted Only Plus, Paid Ads, type of Forum - anonymous Popup vendors not allowed to post here - We get SO little activity overall, that 1 or 2 "shill reviews" can totally skew impressions - In the Kratom world it's all word of mouth advertising, anyway - Double MM is well established now, there's a large Lurker base of looky loo's here, it's ALL about buying & selling - more of these popup's should Help Support the place - either putup or shutup lol

[WhiteAngelica]

Botanical Bunny is a great vendor with consistency. But everyone gets a dud sometimes. I am going to order it and see for myself. They are definitely one of my top 5 favorite vendors.

[yung_lee]

I had been ordering from BB pretty much exclusively for almost 3 years and never felt the need to branch out because they were very consistent. In the last half a year or so it seems like they have been having supply issues or something. They've had way fewer varieties and what they did have just didn't seem to do it for me. Not necessarily saying there has been a decline in quality or anything, just my personal experience.

[Roofdog]

Sounds like a sidestep of 'I was corrected.' But glad to have you here.

Have you joined MeWe? There are several kratom groups there, and a coffee group from which I'm procuring the finest coffee.

Aloha.

Whats the coffe group? I am very interested.

[IndelibleDotInk]

dm me your account name here and i'll add you as a contact and i'll invite you.

'btotheck .' is our fearless leader, i guess 'chris w' and me are second in commands as eager students. I'm 'IndelibleDotInk .' The coffee here... will blow your mind.

there's a kava group too, but much less actvitiy.

[Ch98579]

Well that sure was something.

Let us know what BB says if you decide to contact them about it. I was thinking the batch seeming subpar could just be the age-old "this works for someone else but not for me" or "put it away and try it again later" kratom crisis, but if multiple people are having issues with the batch, it's definitely worth bringing to BB's attention. I'm sure they'd want to know. Might have just slipped under their radar somehow. As far as I'm aware they have a good reputation, so I wouldn't expect them not to care, y'know?

Update: They offered to replace it for me so that is a positive. I’ll follow up when that happens.

[Babel-17]

Right, I'm aware that some folks can pay for ads for forums (I'm a LONG time admin of many, many forums, some of which had millions of users each week).

Did any have "Kelly" as part of their name? I used to visit two such, they were both very good and very popular.

[Badgame85]

The traditional B-B Kratom is Direct Import from well known, top Indo sources: Kratom Crumbs, VLNT Herb, Golden Green, Nugroz, and others...

This is wild man. Second ever purchase of Kratom I ever made was through Kratom Crumbs. (First was with Happy Hippo...don't get me started on that )

I have also ordered direct through VNLT several times and Nugroz. Connected with both of them through Facebook groups. I had no idea that these were Indo vendors that my favorite stateside vendors were purchasing from! For some foolish reason I thought that all the well known state side vendors had connections with like secret farmers and such as part of like an elite group of Domestic/Indo Vendors. Guess the world is smaller than I thought.

I eventually cut off all international ordering because:

A.) I don't need as much as they want to sell at any given time
B.) The quicker shipping and customer service of state side vendors.

That is key right there. Absolutely any time I've had an issue with any vendor (except Golden Monk...don't get me started on that either lol) the service I have received is incredible. Everyone is right, that word of mouth probably drives like 85% of each vendors sales.

So as many have suggested, I suggest that anyone DEFINITELY contact the vendor prior to bashing the product... especially one that you have a relationship with. These guys/gals will lay down the red carpet for you almost every time. Not the case with direct from Indo purchase.

[Kelleytoons]

Right, I'm aware that some folks can pay for ads for forums (I'm a LONG time admin of many, many forums, some of which had millions of users each week).

Did any have "Kelly" as part of their name? I used to visit two such, they were both very good and very popular.

No - in the first place my name is "Kelley" <g>.

One of them was the Florida Retirement Forums - at the time it was the ONLY retirement forum for folks coming to Florida (and if typed "Florida retirement" it was number one in the Google search, but that was long before their AI kept paid subscribers at the top). Another was an animators forum where even Spielberg visited (and another was a music composition forum - we even had Henry Mancini as a member). I do have a website called "Kelleytown.com" but it's a grab bag of various things.

Days long past, however.

[Babel-17]

Thanks for that info! I spaced out on the spelling, I guess it not mattering in the sound of the name was a factor.

[Ch98579]

The traditional B-B Kratom is Direct Import from well known, top Indo sources: Kratom Crumbs, VLNT Herb, Golden Green, Nugroz, and others...

This is wild man. Second ever purchase of Kratom I ever made was through Kratom Crumbs. (First was with Happy Hippo...don't get me started on that )

I have also ordered direct through VNLT several times and Nugroz. Connected with both of them through Facebook groups. I had no idea that these were Indo vendors that my favorite stateside vendors were purchasing from! For some foolish reason I thought that all the well known state side vendors had connections with like secret farmers and such as part of like an elite group of Domestic/Indo Vendors. Guess the world is smaller than I thought.

I eventually cut off all international ordering because:

A.) I don't need as much as they want to sell at any given time
B.) The quicker shipping and customer service of state side vendors.

That is key right there. Absolutely any time I've had an issue with any vendor (except Golden Monk...don't get me started on that either lol) the service I have received is incredible. Everyone is right, that word of mouth probably drives like 85% of each vendors sales.

So as many have suggested, I suggest that anyone DEFINITELY contact the vendor prior to bashing the product... especially one that you have a relationship with. These guys/gals will lay down the red carpet for you almost every time. Not the case with direct from Indo purchase.

Seriously. Golden Monk can be pretty awful

[add to descartes]

Pennies on the dollar, kid.

Look - I hate to be "the old man" here, but clearly I am. And clearly none of you have run a real business,

there's really no need for condescension

[terposton]

there are a few other men with as much experience as you in some areas.

i'll stop wasting money at this point. Thanks guys.

IndelibleDotInk don't believe it. Just because he's old and thinks knows everything, not true, I read some of his post . I'm old and don't know everything or pretend that I do. In fact, I'm learning a lot from the younger people and you especially on this forum. I'm really going to try to learn from you regarding coffee for sure.

[Kelleytoons]

Haters gonna hate <bg>.

[dylanmckay11]

Botanical Bunny is a great vendor with consistency. But everyone gets a dud sometimes. I am going to order it and see for myself. They are definitely one of my top 5 favorite vendors.

That is only time its happened to me with BB. I consider them in the top 3. Someone else mentioned bashing. I wasn't bashing BB. I was surprised when I saw this thread that it was the same batch I had no response from. So I wrote a quick response.
Only other time with BB one time there was a missing item from the order. But I contacted them and they reshipped it out for free. So great customer service. I didn't want to contact them this time cause I think some people when they have multiple things happen over time and ask vendor to replace or ship out another item. More than once.
It could look like the customer is trying to take advantage of the vendor. Even if that isn't what's happening.